#2 Audi R8 - One of the slower R8's

[Spiny Anteater]

The random trail has remained in R1, so at least I'm adjusted to the speed. That's usually my biggest problem when going from or coming to R1 is adjusting to the higher speeds and turning ability.

The #2 R8 is the newest of the fleet of R8's in Forza, yet the car has the 2nd worst PI, with only the #88 car being worse. I can only assume that 2005 or 2006 saw a tightening of a regulation somewhere or other.

It's early days yet, but the R8 has already shown an extra couple of mph at the top end compared to the Peugeot. The two cars were also within a tenth of a second of one another at Sunset Short (both ways), but when I noted down the set-up for this thread I noticed that I had still been running with no toe in the set-up. That might explain why the Audi struggled compared to the Peugeot in the fast corners, even though it was slightly better in most other areas. I'll re-run the track and see if it's any better with the standard -0.2 degree rear toe.

[Spiny Anteater]

Low Downforce setup-

Tune:
Tyres: 28/28
Gears: FD - 3.18, 1-6 - 2.48, 1.91, 1.52, 1.23, 1.03, 0.91 (Motegi Oval)
Camber: -0.9/-0.7
Toe: 0/-0.2 (but 0/0 on the Speedway)
Caster: 5.4
ARBs: 24.30/23.99
Springs: 352.7/366.4
Ride Height: n/a / n/a
Rebound: 5.8/6.4
Bump: 3.4/3.6 (changed to 3.4/3.2)
Aero: 136/317 (min)
Braking: 46% Front/110% Pressure
Diff: 35% Accel/25% Decel

Benchmark:
0-60: 3.339s
0-100: 5.606s
Top Speed: 203.2 mph
60-0: 77.0 ft
120-0: 199.9 ft
g's@60: 1.58
g's@120: 1.90

[Spiny Anteater]

High Downforce Set-up - This one feels pretty good, for an R1. It's certainly stable enough that I really struggled when I pulled out the non-R Class cars online

Tune:
Tyres: 28/28
Gears: FD - 3.18, 1-6 - 2.48, 1.91, 1.60, 1.37, 1.18, 1.05 (Silverstone National gear set)
Camber: -0.7/-0.5
Toe: 0/-0.2
Caster: 5.4
ARBs: 24.00/24.29
Springs: 393.2/509.4
Ride Height: n/a / n/a
Rebound: 5.6/6.6
Bump: 3.3/3.8
Aero: 407/950 (max)
Braking: 46% Front/110% Pressure
Diff: 35% Accel/25% Decel

Benchmark:
0-60: 3.182s
0-100: 5.376s
Top Speed: 185.8 mph
60-0: 74.0 ft
120-0: 181.1 ft
g's@60: 1.64
g's@120: 2.12

[Spiny Anteater]

One of the slower R8's it may be (at least according to the PI), but it certainly seems pretty well matched against that Peugeot. Not an absolute match - initial runs have shown it to have a faster QR, PR, FR and TR than the Peugeot, but the gaps are generally pretty small (ranging between 0.6 seconds on the Speedway and 0.003 seconds at Mugello Short).

In fact, the gaps have been so consistently small (most have been under 0.2 seconds/lap) that I'm beginning to suspect that R1 is generally quite well balanced. It's just that Ferrari, the R10 and (apparantly - I haven't bought it) the 908 which are out of sync with the rest. It wouldn't be a problem if these cars were slower than the rest, but being slightly faster there is naturally a tendency for the masses to jump into these.

As for how the R8 and 905 compare, the first thing which struck me was the higher top speed of the R8, but then again the first track I ran was the Speedway. The only place the R8 is significanty slower seems to be on acceleration out of slow corners. I presume this is due to turbo lag which obviously doesn't affect the normally aspirated Peugeot. The Audi is also very slightly worse under brakes, but to be honest the difference between the two is almost negligible.

For me, the area where the R8 really scores over the Peugeot is consistency. As I mentioned earlier, the two cars are very similar in a single lap condition. However, in a race scenario I am almost always faster in the R8. That's mainly due to it being easier to drive, but it also partly due to the fact that it's easier to get a good start off the line in the R8 - the Peugeot tends to bog down at first, then you have to fight the wheelspin higher up the rev range. Finding the throttle balance is much easier with the R8

[Fit4aking]

I've had the Audi's in R1 for quite some time now and they are all very fast but as everyone know's I like variety so I only keep them around for the parts discount (all are level 5).  I bought the 905 to get the "all cars" achievement and I kept it around because it was rather rare.  I never did anything with it, its just sat and sat in may garage just like all my other R class cars.  I tweek one or two, take a heading to the lower classes and never really get a full toon on one.  I built out the 905 using your high downforce tune and headed off tot he professional series, boy is that car difficult to get off the line.  Just like you said it either bogs down and maintains traction or it decides to rev out and roast the rears right off the thing.  I never did get a clean race out of the car, R1 is very accident prone, and as we all know the AI is less than clean.  I look forward to trying out your HD setup on the Audi and trying both with the AI on ignoramus to compare race times.

[Spiny Anteater]

You're right about the AI, it is very difficult to get a clean race in R1. And it's particularly annoying that they don't suffer any aero ill-effects from that collision which wipes out your front/rear downforce. The only race ai ran without any collisions in the Peugeot was the endurance, and that was mostly down to being super-careful on my part. Even on the speedway, I was braketested (I failed the test by the way) on the first run, and was sideswiped into the wall ont he second.

The R8 is a much better starter, and where there is a long rundown to the first corner, you can escape much of that nonsense, unless you're unlucky enough to be at the 'Ring, where the high downforce means the AI gets a 2nd bite at you.

Fit - if you find the magic formula for getting the 905 off the line, let me know. As far as I can tell, you need fantastic throttle control to even have a chance with that car - that or you end up with 1st gear so high it will bog down about 20 yards off the start line.

[Spiny Anteater]

It's been over a month since the last post, but I am still on with this. It's just that I've been distracted by things such as Sockmonkeys and moving house so progress is slow. As the 360 gets packed away tomorrow, now seems like a good time for a progress update.

The times of this and the Peugeot 905 are still very close, in fact they seem closer now than they did last time I wrote anything here. The QR defintely seems to favour the R8 though - with a more complete set of times up the cars seem incredibly evenly matched (on Mugello Short and Boomslang Reverse) they are separated by onyl 0.003s at each track. Using my preferred system of percentage time, the gaps between the two range from <0.005% at Mugello Short to 0.77% at the Speedway. I'll be surprised if there's more than 10 seconds gap in the total time of the 52 tracks between these 2 cars.

[Blooze]

It will be interesting to see if chance sets you up with another of the R8s - #5 perhaps.  I would like another opinion on the hidden PI value that appears to affect cars from one end of the spectrum to the other.

Also, I am in hopes that luck will place you in the Bently.  That is my current top R1 car.  I would like to see if it is the same for you.

$

[Spiny Anteater]

It will be interesting to see if chance sets you up with another of the R8s - #5 perhaps.  I would like another opinion on the hidden PI value that appears to affect cars from one end of the spectrum to the other.

Also, I am in hopes that luck will place you in the Bently.  That is my current top R1 car.  I would like to see if it is the same for you.

$

I really hope not. At least not yet (or when I get the box plugged in and wired up). I'm getting a bit bored of R1 after the Peugeot and R8 in quick succession.

As it happens I ran the Bentley and the #2 R8 when I did the initial run through of Career. Although both tunes were feuerdog's v.3 with very little modification, it certainly seemed as if the R8 was a bit of a dog while the Bentley was half decent, although not up to F333 standards. Weirdly though, the Bentley didn't respond as well to v.5 as most of the other cars and so is now sitting there with a Blooze toon on

As for the various R8's, when i ranked the garage by PI it was noticeable that the PI increases as the cars get newer, until the latest 2 versions (which includes the #2) where it takes a big jump backwards so the cars are worse than the older models. I presume this is the reflect the incremental changes as the car is developed year on year and that there must have been a change in real life regulations in (IIRC) 2005. I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who feels that the cars are all different though.

[Spiny Anteater]

'Tis complete, and about time too! Moving house and all the attendant time lost really delayed completion of this one. But finally, I can move onto the summing up:

For the most part this car ran very, very similar times to the Peugeot and only really pulled ahead on the snake tracks. It was only headed by the Peugeot on 3 snakes, and the gaps on two of those were 0.023 and 0.003 seconds. It was only on King Cobra forwards that it really lost out (by 0.7 seconds) although the gap of 1.8 seconds in the Audi's favour on the reverse track suggests there may have been some wheel-nut issues there. The overall gap between the two cars was 13 seconds in the Audi's favour, but 6 seconds of these came on the snakes.

To say that surprised me is an understatement. i had thought that the Audi would suffer with it's turbocharging vs. the N/A of the 905, but that didn't prove to be the case. While the Audi seems slightly more slippery and hence had a higher top speed, it didn't seem to accelerate as well as the Peugeot once the motor was spooled up. At lower speeds, there was very little to choose between them, but the faster snake times suggest that the Audi has better traction and/or grip.

Once again, I was very surprised at how close the cars were on all the tracks - the maximum gaps were 0.77% at the Nissan Speedway and 0.75% at Diamondback forwards. So, the final times for this car are:

Total: 59 minutes, 30.460 seconds
QR: 148.732s
PR: 152.563s
FR: 114.002s
TR: 116.061s

Now, time to move on...

[Snyder005]

hey Spiny can you generate me a random car? wanna try out tuning something different. 

[Spiny Anteater]

PM sent - if it's not to your liking I can always generate more.