Author Topic: The Bench  (Read 25409 times)

barumba

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #375 on: August 17, 2010, 03:38:00 PM »
Nice flame out, Blooze. That must have taken a bit of time. Time well spent. As for the "revelations" in Hellisan's tune, ie: the stock trany and no slicks...There was a  discussion in another couple of threads about "DOTS" and "ASTON DB5", though it was more about tire pressure, but still on non-slick tires.
Did you make observation of the grip coefficient numbers in the upgrade pages before and after the comparison. 'twould be interesting to see how the game models and displays this.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2010, 06:41:53 AM by Blooze »
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Re: The Bench
« Reply #376 on: August 17, 2010, 05:27:58 PM »
Thanks Barumba.  The Flames on the front are Drift's.   I just built the ones around the "B2"

I'll do more documenting when I change one of mine.  I didn't look around too much at the time because I was all hot to get the parts on and add my setup to it - I was looking forward to it because I just knew it was gonna be a butt kicker...

Here's the link to his release.  He discussed the tires at the top of page 2.  

Hellisan's Evo VI release.

;D $
« Last Edit: August 17, 2010, 06:51:20 PM by Blooze »
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Spiny Anteater

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #377 on: August 18, 2010, 11:22:25 AM »
Thanks Barumba.  The Flames on the front are Drift's.   I just built the ones around the "B2"

...

Well, if I'm being honest those were the ones I was admiring. Nice to see my name immortalised with the "Spiny Fix" too ;D
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Blooze

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #378 on: August 19, 2010, 06:45:51 AM »
Well, if I'm being honest those were the ones I was admiring. Nice to see my name immortalised with the "Spiny Fix" too ;D
Thank you Spiny - I think I am starting to get a handle on using those fades.

Heh...  I named it that in honor of you always telling me how you had to adjust to get a little more oversteer.  Fit has told me the same thing a few times...  I spose I should have named it, The Spiny Fit.

;D $
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Fit4aking

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #379 on: August 23, 2010, 09:58:44 AM »
Spent a HUGE amount of time this weekend doing endless paperwork.  Not my favorite but it had to be done.  The up side to my efforts came when the wife noticed that I was starting to get weary looking at my laptop and pouring over forms.  She suggested I take a break and do some Forzacating.  Not something I get to do in the middle of the day. 

I decided to keep on building my GT3/R3 garage and actually started to tune the cars instead of just running them as is.  The Mustang did very well and I quickly retired it at Level 5 to move on to another car.  I remembered that the #2 Viper was constantly on my tail so I decided to give it a shot and boy what a fun car that is.  Loads of front grip, loads of power and a very linear feel even when it starts to lose traction.  Very likely a drifters dream with a couple tweaks.  I piloted that chassis up to Level 5 and parked it after completing a couple of Events in it to knock off a few more blocks on the grid.  I went a bit crazy deciding on the next car to buy and after a bunch of deliberation I pulled the trigger on the R3 Volvo.  Oh boy.......

The car launches like nobodies business and strides to an early lead in all of the races I've started so far.  I ran it untuned and it was understeering a bit but it was expected.  Unfortunately I was losing so much time on corner entry that exit speed wasn't enough to make up any of the ground I'd lose.  I broke down and put a total Fit-Tune on it.  I had it set up witha bit of understeer on corner entry and a bit of understeer on corner exit but if I set up the turns correctly I was golden as it maintained grip so well.  I still wasn't where I thought I should be with the car and I started to try and tweak the turn in as I was still slowing way down on corner entry.  Needless to say I haven't cured this beast and I'm tossing my ususal oversteer antics at it.  Still seems like corner entry is the culprit but I admit I haven't spent a lot of time watching telemetry.

I began to get frustrated and moved on to a GT3 Porsche instead and that car surprised the socks off of me for having such low power numbers.  Onward and forwad to this week and I hope to have a night or two to spend on my Volvo and finish leveling up my new Porsche.  Til then I'd better stick my nose back to the grind stone.
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Re: The Bench
« Reply #380 on: August 23, 2010, 10:59:09 PM »
That sounds great.  I hope to get started on my GT3 garages soon.  I have one for S Class and another for R3.  I don't know how it is all going to work out in the end, but I am wanting to make a major project of it.  I don't know if I mentioned it or not, but I built out a leaderboard template that can be used for any of these "subclasses"... specially when they run times that are not going to be in the top of the class - they will be comparative within their subclass.  I call the sheets a ? Hot Lap Cup.  There will be the GT3, the DTM, the BTCC, and so on.  You are welcome to a copy of the template if you would like it.  The idea is to include the car's tuning sheets with the leaderboards so it is all in one place.

How are you coming up with equality between the cars you've tried?

:D $

Oops - forgot the template.  For it to work right, the cars have to stay in the same order on each of the time sheets.  That is why the "Sorter" is provided - it can be used to assign a position/order to the cars.  The low time for each track will be highlighted on all of the time sheets.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2010, 04:53:25 PM by Blooze »
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Fit4aking

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #381 on: August 24, 2010, 08:17:05 AM »
On the topic of car parity within a subset, I think it is a good idea but I will likely just use the template for the FIL as it includes the QR tracks and I can label or "save as" whatever subset I decide to use.  The cars are vastly different, the AWD Volvo, the grippy yet stable Viper, the oversteery Corvette, and my cerner exit king Porsche, make quite an attack squad for the different track types.  So far I haven't run any of the cars through QR nor have I had much overlap in the tracks used on the Events List. 

Of the tracks that did cover two series, Sedona is going to be the showdown track, likely due to its flowing nature and the cars ability to maintain corner speed..  Sebring may be another but that long straight is going to weed out the top speed challanged.  As an overall group though I think they will do well to knock off some of my R3 times while I decide what cars to run up to the top of the class for an all out top time run.

On a side note, I ran an R2 Corvette last night just to compare the R3 and R2 and I fell in love with the way the R2 Corvette ran around Camino.  Talk about a car and driver jiving right off the line.  Sheer driving pleasure.  Can't wait to add that to the other R2 cars I've been accruing for that venture.
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Blooze

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #382 on: August 25, 2010, 02:39:26 PM »
Heavens...  Here it is lunch time already.  Sort of.  Forza wise, I been busier than the proverbial one legged feller this week.   I finally decided to just shut the box down and catch some stuff up.  I got posting to do, I got spreadsheets that are requiring attention.  This being a multimillion dollar racing organization all by yourself can be taxing.

 :-\


If this segment were to be titled, I would be trying to come up with some cute variation of the old saw about old dawgs and new tricks and that sort of thing.  I was talking recently about the Toon that I bought from Helisan, and how there was a bunch of stuff that was uncommon for me to see.  I have had a pretty well established regimine for when it comes to upgrades and tuning and such so I find I was a prime candidate for getting my eyeballs opened up, along with my mind.  Ruts are a terrible thing.

There was no doubt about it.  Helisan's Evo VI build was faster in the A Class everything than anything in my garage - and definitely faster than my A Class GSX.  Disassembling the thing and scatterin' the parts all over the garage showed two major deviations from my norm...  On a car that started out as a low C, the A build had stock transmission and clutch, and it had the Sport compound rather than slicks.   So I set about studying the thing with respect to my GSX builds, mostly cause I know the why's and what nots to the various builds from E to A.

First of all, there is the Slicks.  The Evo has a G@120 of 1.24 with the Sport tires, my GSX has a 1.21 with slicks.  A little investigation shows why.   The Evo weighs in at 2261 with full reduction, the GSX weighed 2630.  There is very little play left - some body parts and the roll cage is about it, but that still only finds another 70 pounds or so.   The other biggie is tire width.  The widest tires for the GSX is 235 mm - the Evo is able to fit 265 mm under it's fenders.   When I checked the affect of swapping out the Slicks for Sport tires, the G@120 dropped 4 points to a 1.17.  There was just no place left to get grip other than the Slicks, so I decided I would have to keep those.  Besides, the swap only freed up 7 Pi.

On the other hand, swapping out the tranmission and clutch for stock freed up 20 or so Pi, enough so that I was able to upgrade the Turbo for an additional 34 Hp, with enough left over to go ahead with the Sport Clutch...  (the shift time was taking a serious hit and a slow shifter bugs the hell out of me.)  Loosing  the weight savings of the transmission and the added weight of the Turbo added 43 lbs to the GSX' curb weight.  The P/W improved 10 points but I lost one point of grip.

But...  I knocked 2 seconds off the GSX' QR.   In fact, I beat the Evo's QR by a few hundreths!  I set a top 1000 Atlanta time with it as well.  It isn't quite as good as the Evo in the twisties, but it had a full half second on both the Drag and the Oval, and about 20 mph on the top end.  I haven't run it all out yet, but the GSX is definitely going to do better on some of the "Power" tracks.

So, my habit of going for the Race Tranny as soon as possible in a series of builds seems to need to be reexamined.  I checked, the E class GSX had a Race Transmission by D Class, Slicks didn't show up untill B class.

Now, the Aero parts and increased Hp worked out pretty good for the overall gearing, but I can see a need for perhaps getting the Sport Transmission in some cases.  The Street Trans mission is good for quite a few tenths on the shift time and a small performance increase, so that is a possibility as well.  The Pi cost vs. the Performance gain of the Clutch packages will be examined more closely as well.  No more of this grab the race clutch without giving it a thought.  The change in all aspects of performance using the stock gearing was just too big to ignore.  I am gonna be going back through a whole piss-pot load of lower class builds, not as a major project, but as I move from class to class - cars will be getting reconfigured.


I spent a great deal of my time this last week pointedly working on technique.  This thing where I get all rigid and tight when turning in on big shut down corners and on long sweepers, has just got to go.  I scrub all sorts of speed because I am too wound up to react and I usually have to drop extra gears and damn near stop to keep out of the wall.  It is improving, but it is definitely going to require seat time to get it second nature.


I'm all hot to get the R3 GT3 Hotlap Cup kicked off - I will be working on that quite a bit this week.  I have quite a few cars left to build.


Ole Buck finally got done with A class.  He's currently at the top of the A Class Chasers board - I don't spect that will last too long.


Another project for this week is to try to ressurrect my Storefront.  I got an idea or two or three... it would go better if I could paint worth a flip.  And I am going to have to quit all the photo procrastinatin' too.  Anyhow, the first release on the startup is going to be the A Class GSX.

Then there is a story that I have been working on and I am going to need a bunch of guys to help me out with some pictures, besides all the business with getting the thing written in the first place.

What a flash in the pan this Forza game is...  

Heh, I see no end in sight...

;D $
« Last Edit: August 25, 2010, 03:39:29 PM by Blooze »
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barumba

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #383 on: August 25, 2010, 07:28:19 PM »
Isn't it great when a different point of view opens your eyes. helisan sure has some interesting tuning techniques.
As for your picture project, I will be more than happy to contribute, just lay out the details.
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EXOR Warpedo

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #384 on: August 27, 2010, 01:09:22 PM »
I just wanted to say thanks to Blooze and everyone who have been partaking in Blooze's various challenges. Thanks for adding some fun to FM3 this summer, I am taking a break from FM3. It is a possibility that I will not return so I want to wish everyone the very best and as always "Race hard and have fun!"

Warped

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #385 on: August 27, 2010, 07:48:31 PM »
Thank you Warped.  Glad you were able to join us, and good luck to you in whatever is next for you.

Blooze

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TheJohnNewton

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #386 on: August 28, 2010, 09:20:29 AM »
Hey Warped.  You're going to let Detrick be 1 second ahead of you in F class?

Thanks for doing your elite garage over on Exodus.  Following you and Detrick's garages has helped me a bit with my tuning and given me (probably impossible) targets to aim for.  Have a good one.
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EXOR Warpedo

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #387 on: August 28, 2010, 08:30:50 PM »
Hey Warped.  You're going to let Detrick be 1 second ahead of you in F class?

Thanks for doing your elite garage over on Exodus.  Following you and Detrick's garages has helped me a bit with my tuning and given me (probably impossible) targets to aim for.  Have a good one.

Detrick needs the ego boost of being ahead of me and if it makes him feel good I am happy to allow it. I have been in the unending cycles of continually lowering times with people before and it is not something I care to put any time into. I also wish you the best.

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Re: The Bench
« Reply #388 on: August 29, 2010, 09:32:15 PM »
That Detrick is a delicate flower.   ;)
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Re: The Bench
« Reply #389 on: August 30, 2010, 08:16:37 AM »
I just wanted to say thanks to Blooze and everyone who have been partaking in Blooze's various challenges. Thanks for adding some fun to FM3 this summer, I am taking a break from FM3. It is a possibility that I will not return so I want to wish everyone the very best and as always "Race hard and have fun!"

Warped

Wha?? :(