Next Series?

[BarbecuePete]

Yeah i would like to do some A-Class and lower racing, cuz its harder to switch from Race Pro to the higher classes. 

U-class Cobra's it is then... 


Taking Hop's idea of specs based on the lobby restrictions I went and had a look to see what they are...

CLASS - No Race Cars / D / C / B / A / S / U / R4 / R3 / R2 / R1
P.I - <1000 / <999 / <951 / <901/ (50 PI reductions) / < 151
POWER - <200hp / 200-300hp / 300-400hp / 400-500hp / 500-600hp / >600hp
REGION - Aisa / Europe / North America
MAKE
MODEL
YEAR - <1976 / 1976-1990 / 1991-1995 / 1996-2000 / 2001-2003 / 2004-2005 / >2005
KERB WEIGHT - <2,055lbs / 2,055-2,500lbs / 2,500-3,000lbs / 3,000-3,500lbs / 3,500-3,850lbs / >3,800lbs
DRIVE - FWD / RWD / AWD
ENGINE - Front / Mid / Rear


So a few ideas for possible lobby based specs...

Club Sports - Mid Engine / RWD / <2,055lbs / <200hp / <751pi

Junior JTCC - Front Engine / FWD / 2,055lbs-2,500lbs / Aisa / 200-300hp / B class

DTM - Front Engine / RWD / Europe / 300-400hp / 2,055 - 2,500 

Classic Open - RWD / <1976 / 300-400hp / <751pi

Classic Lightweight - RWD / <1976 / <600pi / <2,055lbs

[fndrbndr]

As an aside, with full weight reduction and slicks, 200hp or less will put you in C class or MAYBE 600 PI on a few cars.  I know this because the tiny terror spec is based around this fact.

As an aside, U-class Cobras could be a lot of fun, but we'd need to turn off TCS, and I don't know how some feel about limiting assists.

[Spiny Anteater]

You can set the assists as you like (at least as far as I'm concerned). Just be aware if ABS is off, someone is likely to end up with me skidding into the back of them

As another possibility for a series, how about a random series. Which basically works like this.

Each week a car and PI (or class) will be chosen at random (either through the random.net site or some other method) and this is the spec to be run next week. That gives everyone a week to get the car to their liking. Each week will see two races run on two randomly chosen tracks, each race to last 20-25 minutes (we can't chose longer, because some tracks don't have pits). The kicker is that you must run the same build/tune on each track so must choose whether to suit one track or the other or go for an intermediate tune.

Thoughts?

[fndrbndr]

Spiny,
I've wanted to a random race for a while.  I'm not sure it will have legs as a series, though.

[BarbecuePete]

As an aside, with full weight reduction and slicks, 200hp or less will put you in C class or MAYBE 600 PI on a few cars.  I know this because the tiny terror spec is based around this fact.

As an aside, U-class Cobras could be a lot of fun, but we'd need to turn off TCS, and I don't know how some feel about limiting assists.

Yeah I think some of the lobby ones I posted may need some tweeks, for example the DTM Spec.

DTM - Front Engine / RWD / Europe / 300-400hp / 2,055 - 2,500

Had a look through my garage and some cars I had in mind, Merc C-class & Lotus Carlton are over 2,500lbs with Full WR while the BMW M3 comes in at under 2,500lbs. 

A better lobby setup could be..

Front Engine / RWD / Europe / <901 PI / 400-500hp


I think a random series could work well though, I think we're all at the stage where we can build and tune a car pretty quickly, we could even do a '1 hour build' with a 5 race series to follow.

[bimmerlovere39]

RWD / <951 PI / 400-500hp

GT500


RWD / <700 PI / 200-300hp

GT300


RWD / <700 PI / 3000-3500lbs / Front Engine

SCCA T2 or so...

[BarbecuePete]

GT500 could be interesting, I'm thinking Jag KX, Aston Martin DB9, Dodge Viper etc.. Something similar to the RL GT3 class.

[bimmerlovere39]

Aye.  911s, M3 GTR, E92 M3, E46 M3, Ferrari 360s...

they could all come out to play 

[fndrbndr]

Yeah, I'd want a year-model restriction or something with that, though.  Actually, I'd prefer a car list: just the top of the line car from each manufacturer.  Though I realize that means a LOT of testing.

[bimmerlovere39]

Honestly, I think that gets too limiting.  Although I do support a year restriction (2000-present)

[fndrbndr]

I'm not sure it's actually too limiting.  If the cars' speeds approach a normal distribution, then taking cars from one section of that distribution that are equal in ability will actually be less limiting than an open approach that forces everyone into the upper "tail" of the curve in order to be competitive.  Witness the very public temptation to move toward scoreboard cars during GT400 testing.  I'll have to think about this some, but my intuition is that it goes from very limiting in a spec/builder's challenge sort of series to not very limiting in a short car list, becoming very limiting again in an entirely open ruleset.  The exact cut points for the slope changes are, of course, a point of conjecture, since we have  a quantitative value for neither limitedness nor openness.

[fndrbndr]

If the above post didn't make sense, then take that as an indication that your weekend was far more fun than mine.   

[Spiny Anteater]

Just an idea which probably wouldn't work, but could you bring in a handicap system for an open series. I'm thinking something along the lines of " a driver must wait 1 second (or some other timescale tbc) per example of his car in the top 1000 before starting the race". So, say you were to run the Exige with, say, 50 examples in the top 1000 at the track in question, you would start 50 seconds after me in my Challenger Concept whicih probably has not top 1000 times.

Or am I making things too complicated now?

But I do agree that without some limit the temptation is there to run a leaderboard car, and that a series is more fun with a good range of entrants (aside from spec/build races obviously).

[Detrick]

Handicap the PI of the scoreboard car.  Say, in increments of 50 or 75.  Kinda like the equivalent of a weight handicap in RL.  So, if you're running a B700 Challenger Concept I can run the Lotus but the build is limited to B650 (...or lower).

I did something similar over at Exodus for an enduro series about a year ago.  I wanted to simulate multiple classes of cars on track at the same time (a 'la ALMS) but it was based on driver skill.  If I had a full lobby with 8 participants the highest two ranked/TS players in the room drove a B700 car, the next two best drivers drove an A750 car, and the bottom 4 drove an A800 car. 

Not sure I would call that experiment successful but it was different.  And if I remember right the B700 cars pulled off some wins even with the handicap.  Check out this link for some details on the car specs.....

http://www.exodusracing.net/index.php/topic,1114.0.html

[RenoWrench]

With the indefinite hold on the patch for RacePro I've gone ahead and started the ground work for the next Forza 2 based Exodus series.  Preliminary details are here:

http://www.exodusracing.net/index.php/topic,2843.msg33091.html#new

I'll probably be organizing an official test and tune in the next week or so.

For info on the last season of the Exodus Vintage Series look here.

http://www.exodusracing.net/index.php/board,35.0.html